where does trainwrecks stream now. By Shannon Liao. where does trainwrecks stream now

 
 By Shannon Liaowhere does trainwrecks stream now  He is usually seen wearing a T-Shirt and pants

13 votes, 14 comments. If you win, check Reddit messages/mail regularly. Same with watch people die, coontown, etc. 9 million he wagered, he held an impromptu giveaway on his stream, handing over $1 million in total to his followers. Trainwreck's new streaming platform, Kick, appears to be a joint project with Stake, the crypto gambling website. Streamer Tyler ‘Trainwrecks’ Niknam has criticized the Kick platform for allowing streamers to inflate their views through bots, especially in regard to gambling streams. Trainwreckstv recently shared. Posted by u/Normiesreeee69 - 233 votes and 40 commentsVod from 28th of September 2019 of Trainwrecks IRL stream at twitch con 2019. Age 32 years old. 6’1”. Unlike Trainwreck, Roshtein seems to win a lot more than he loses. Train was 2 hours late last night because of internet issues but decided to do a 1 hour 30 minute intro anyways. He also streams late as fuck which sucks. Comments ( 596) Last week, streamer Trainwreck got handed a five-day suspension by Twitch after a video went viral featuring an incendiary rant against women streamers. If you miss the stream, rewatch the VOD to see if you won. Though Trainwrecks and XQC have both claimed that they don't. By Shannon Liao. Better lock his doors tonight. . Time zone. Trainwrecks had an extremely lucrative sponsorship deal with the crypto gambling service Stake. Trainwreck, who has repeatedly endorsed Stake, did not disclose Stake’s involvement in his TwitLonger. Trainwreck, who has repeatedly endorsed Stake, did not disclose Stake’s involvement in his TwitLonger. Used to watch Train every single time for months. $10 million - $15 million. After all, based on Adin’s current activities, it felt like a lot, as sources claimed him to make around $100k from Twitch monthly. Reply. 6. Train really should look into writing fantasy novels because his ability to make. com, which. It’ll be interesting to see which other Stake streamers follow over to the new platform. Birth Sign Sagittarius. Trainwrecks is untouchable. The tweet garnered plenty of attention as the date. Additionally, Stake has already begun doing promotional material involving the platform. Twitch streamer TrainWrecks hosts $1 million giveaway for his stream chat . I don’t have a clip but I’m sure someone does. com is actually yielding him much more than $1 million. Somebody at reddit probably hates train and banned his dumb ass the second they had an actual reason to despite not caring about the other 1000 instances that happens a day. Train has over 24 million views on his YouTube channel overall, and has around 193k subscribers as of now. Twitch star Tyler ‘Trainwreck’ Niknam is moving to an all-new platform, Kick, as “a non-owner advisor and non-exclusive broadcaster. On a whirlwind mid-May installment of controversial streamer Tyler “Trainwrecks” Niknam’s popular Scuffed Podcast —on which a large number of streamers regularly gather to discuss various. Niknam, 30, is a top streamer on Twitch, where he’s better known as Trainwrecks to his 1. I'd rather watch someone sitting down, being funny and interacting with chat, rather than someone who forces his so called "content" while acting like a total spastic in public for his fanbase consisting of complete degenerates. Take frequent breaks. First, he explained why people shouldn’t gamble, even though he was doing so while offering the advice. Trainwrecks Gambling Revenue. com) is a video live streaming service. “I tell people not to gamble very often, especially when I win and that they will always lose,” he said. Published Feb 14, 2023. Coffeezilla (one of the best internet investigators) somehow exposed that "trainwrecks streaming website" is owned by stake. GameStop Moderna Pfizer Johnson & Johnson AstraZeneca Walgreens Best Buy Novavax SpaceX Tesla. Trainwreck. Height. Trainwreck. I do not have discussion accounts, or any other accounts. Train is different because he is given a flat rate with no restrictions besides having to stream a certain amount of gambling. Currently there are no signs that Trainwrecks is looking to leave Twitch, move to another platform, or quit streaming. Trainwrecks claimed that 90 out of the top 100 streamers on Twitch are blatantly viewbotting. After weeks of teasing a new streaming platform, Trainwreck. 5k per month due to subscribers. Kick will reportedly take a 5 percent cut with 95 percent going to the streamer. com While there are a lot. An hourly wage for every eligible streamer. Leeched, scammed off of every famous streamer and then forced himself on to their girlfriends, but most of his twitch chat are newfrogs and were like 12 five years ago lol. However, in the context of Trainwrecks. Trainwrecks blames jealousy and insecurity for the reason as to why he is getting criticized for gambling. stake pay everton £10m a year for as their main shirt sponsor. It is operated by Kick Streaming Pty Ltd and backed by Stake. Trainwrecks was in the middle of a discussion with fans when his. Especially with that kinda money, usage isn't ever a concern. In a recent Twitch stream, the. Only gamble with money you can afford to lose. 6 million of those men have significant balding, thinning, or receded hairline. It. Gambling Streaming, referred to by some as Gamba, is a controversy surrounding sponsored gambling streamers on Twitch. Train markets Kick as a creator-friendly platform that will overtake Twitch and seems pretty convinced it will be a surefire success. This means that he starts out with a base monthly income at least $37,065 USD per month. You all don't know it's fake because you never watched train when he was a 20-50 viewer WoW streamer, he never used to stutter, and he's had a long history of using people to garner popularity, also of heavy shit talking which was always funny. Since my appreciation thread got reported and got dickrider spams, neutral thread for Nick for providing content, neither good or bad. com, and was infuriated when Twitch moved to ban on-stream gambling in October 2022. * We used the following calculation to estimate Trainwrecks net worth: We estimate that 10 % of TrainwrecksTV’s follower on twitch followed his links and signed up with an online casino. According to Twitch Tracker, Trainwrecktstv had an average of 29,745 monthly subscribers in the last 6 months. Idk why people dont criticize Hasan more for having a mansion not only in LA but in Trainwrecks and XQC's minds. Kick will reportedly take a 5 percent cut with 95 percent going to the streamer. Umdterps7 • 3 yr. His viewers describe him as the crazy Texan Ape with a great sense of humor. Hi Nick u are my favorite streamer ive been watchin you for like a decade now u are so funny and handsome. clips. Tyler Faraz “Trainwreckstv” Niknam’s current net worth is estimated to be $360 million. Trainwreckstv, a Twitch content creator, reveals that he earned an incredible amount of money from doing gambling streams on the platform. Those boys are addicted. But a notably larger portion of his donated. In his YouTube video covering xQc's Kick signing, Nash dissected the streamer's contract. Kick (also known as Kick. Trainwrecks would often stream for 20 to 40 hours during the lockdown, playing slots the majority of the time. Heated gaming moment. He will often make $1,000 bets or greater each time, equaling millions of dollars per stream. In June 2021, Trainwreckstv relocated to Canada and began streaming gambling sessions live on Twitch while playing on Stake. com, a new streaming site that offers 95% of revenue to creators from subscriptions. Ape is arguing that streaming is the best thing for Greek right now although he is using the dumbest arguments to defend his point. this can change depending on luck obviously but considering train has been playing for a year straight the number will be very close. He can then expect more revenue in the form of sponsorships, tiered subscriptions, donations, Twitch cheer bit donations, merchandise. When you're coked up you can feel yourself begin dropping off around 20mins after a line, especially when you're deep in a sesh. Regardless of who. Twitter: Trainwreck. Trainwreckstv announced a new livestreaming platform called Kick on December 6, 2022 (Image via KickStreaming/Twitter) On December 6, 2022, Twitch sensation Tyler "Trainwreckstv" took the. He needs to be getting paid more like $3 million a month to cover his losses and be profitable. That’s where his value comes. This followed after Trainwrecks revealed his sponsored earnings. havent been watching over a year, sad to see what it is now, but less hour streams. 5) If you think your post will win and/or is entered in the competition, be sure to watch the SATURDAY stream. Despite this, Trainwrecks claims that his gambling streams are transparent and tackle the difficult. Set a money limit in advance. Twitch does nearly no marketing for streamers, no discovery, and limited help in building their business. be. Screengrab via Twitch. Shop. its gambling policy. While streaming with some friends, Trainwrecks was casually talking when the streamer xQc joined his call, asking if they were ready to start. Wait. Okay dude. TrainWrecksTV primarily makes money on Youtube through Adsense. He was basically Ice Poseidon levels of entertainment before Ice was even around. Trainwreck, one of the internet's most prominent streamers, devised a well-thought-out plan to resurrect gambling-related content just as the Amazon-owned platform decided to end it a month ago. If you miss the stream, rewatch the VOD to see if you won. Somehow Train convinced Mitch, a 6-8k+ streamer at that time, to share 50% of stream revenue when they duo lmao. Kai's Twitch stream agreed with Trainwreck that he was being undervalued by Twitch. Tyler had been without a virtual home since Twitch banned slots from its platform back in October 2022. In a recent stream on September 3, Trainwrecks brought in even more clarity about the nature of such streaming deals and what they meant. It’ll be interesting to see which other Stake streamers follow over to the new platform. Axiun, the guy thats been Greeks friend the longest before he got all his fame aswell, is generally on Apes side agreeing that in his opinion Greek genuinely likes when his community is positive and Greek should. GameStop Moderna Pfizer Johnson & Johnson AstraZeneca Walgreens Best Buy Novavax SpaceX Tesla. I can't speak to names/process in the clip. Leeched, scammed off of every famous streamer and then forced himself on to their girlfriends, but most of his twitch chat are newfrogs and were like 12 five years ago lol. Since streams are not region-locked, this makes no sense. Trainwreck says nothing will change after Twitch gambling ban. If you win, check Reddit messages/mail regularly. Tyler “Trainwrecks” Niknam is a gamer and gambler with 2. All content can be watched LIVE on Twitch. Press J to jump to the feed. It is known that the streamer Trainwrecks has a similar deal with the Stake casino that pays him 1 million USD monthly for gambling on the Stake casino live on stream. Tyler had been without a virtual home since Twitch banned slots from its platform back in October 2022. Trainwreck, one of the streamers impacted by Twitch's new ban on non-U. The "Slots" section on Twitch has become the latest burning issue as many big streamers have begun urging Twitch to ban gambling from the platform as they think that it might have serious negative. He will then stream for 8-12 hours or so. Don't think of gambling as a way to make money. How much does Trainwreck make? According to leaked data that surfaced in 2021, Trainwreck made $1,572,912 from his streams alone between Aug. Watch it on Prime Video, Vudu Movie & TV Store or VUDU on your Roku device. A Twitch user’s misogynist rant has brought the streaming platform’s standards under scrutiny. 25, 2023, 3:30 p. Twitch streamer Trainwreck announces crypto-backed Kick. 133 votes, 43 comments. Like he’s obviously peaking you can see his eyes and how his so focused on the game but as far as crack idk that shit fucks ya and you can’t live a normal life after a while On Dec. 4) On Saturday, all submissions are watched on stream and the top 3 winners are voted via chat/viewer Strawpoll. com is actually yielding him much more than $1 million. 7 million slashing through slots live on his twitch stream. Train solo streaming used to. CryptoHow much did trainwrecks make from Bitcoin? Trainwrecks donates $64,000 in Bitcoin to StableRonaldo’s mom on Twitch. Like honestly this rap is shit no one thinks it's good, funny or entertaining so why keep repeating it. To later reveal that he indeed does NOT pay artist. He talked about how stressful it is working on this new project. 5. Train and XQC personally are bringing in probably upwards of 10 million a month combined, which means the. My friend (small streamer compared with 500-1k viewers) has a deal with gambling site, and he gets paid for that of course, but no money is given for him to play, deal is pretty much u have to play x amount of hours a month on stream and u get x amount of money for that, if u go under site is not giving u the money back. According to Wired, Niknam often streams for multiple hours a day gambling on the cryptocurrency gambling site Stake. This was one of the streams of all time. TrainwrecksTV Saying the N word. The place for all things livestreaming. can you guys at least. This total does not include revenue from other platforms such as Youtube, Sponsorships or merch. Kick, the upcoming crypto-backed streaming platform, is making waves with the creators it is attracting from Twitch. But instead he just keeps on repeating this idea of "trust me, I know better than you about this" and then provide really shitty comparison, which doesn't help his case. Streaming star Tyler ‘Trainwreck’ Niknam has unveiled some details about the Creator Program for his new streaming service, Kick, with plans to “work toward financial security for all. com (Kick) as a non-owner advisor. By John Serba Aug. Omg it's not a. “I’ve always been on the crossroads of this gambling stuff,” he explained. Dude recently talked about which streams he likes to watch in his leisure time, and it's literally the r/lsf starterpack. 00. Like us, Trainwreckstv loves the crypto slots. Train was literally a fucking retard leech scammer in his early days on twitch. Streaming on Roku. Either way, it seems like Trainwrecks is getting a bit burnt out from all the gambling streams. Trainwrecks revealed how he has almost given away an. ago. 19. Trainwreck, one of the internet's most prominent streamers, devised a well-thought-out plan to resurrect gambling-related content just as the Amazon-owned platform decided to end it a month ago. " Throughout the FIFA World Cup 2022 event. Shit guys we woke up shroud. After a somewhat rocky opening, Kick has begun attracting a few medium-sized streamers to the platform, gaining thousands of viewers. 1 Surround Sound effects. But like I said Lacari didn’t say anything, which is enabling. I believe this is all fake news in terms of the $16 an hour, however it would be an interesting way to kill off most competitive streaming platforms by paying an hourly rate regardless. ago. Stream It Or Skip It: ‘Vacation Friends 2’ on Hulu, in Which Lil Rel Howery and John Cena Reunite to Remind Us the First Movie Existed. ggx gang. An annual income of $8k to $10k is expected. The host goes in on the dude for personal shit and forgets his mommy and daddy paved the wave for him to get circle jerked by a bunch of teenage edgelords. Tyler ‘Trainwrecks’ Niknam caught wind of being “mocked” by NICKMERCS on stream and after seeing the clip, he explained why they could never be friends. Trainwreck has announced that he'll be working with streaming platform, Kick and the community has reacted to the soft launch of the new competitor to Twitch. Political commentator and YouTube streamer Destiny revealed that fellow content creator Trainwreckstv offered him $100,000 after he was banned. Trainwreck announces a new streaming platform called Kick, teasing future features than can compete with Amazon’s streaming platform Twitch. But when she gets involved with a sweet sports surgeon (Bill Hader), she finds. There was a long enough pause to where clearly Trihex wasn't trying to cut him off. 19. " JakenBake has been. 25. Now to ban gambling they didn’t need a leverage for Twitch to care, as the pressure from both streamers and more. 4h, but that also includes guys who have reruns like Gaules (>700h, basicly 24/7) and companys. While playing a round of a gambling game during his livestream on Feb. Amy (Amy Schumer) enjoys a life free from stifling romantic commitment until she accidentally falls for the subject of a new article she's writing. How many hours does Trainwreckstv stream on Twitch? According to his Twitch account, Trainwreckstv has ~10,590 subscribers, and usually attracts over 6,000 viewers. Its better now because iirc twitch did something to change their api in 2020(?) that killed the way a lot of viewbots worked. . Again, a big part of the appeal and one of the main reasons why fans in general like to watch Twitch casino streaming. Last Modified Feb 20, 2023 06:37 GMT. Two of the funniest and most twisted minds in comedy--Judd Apatow and Amy Schumer--unite for this unrated version of the comedy hit. com. Last week, professional streamer Trainwrecks lashed out at a group of. If you look at the track-record for Twitch's competitors. Mans is so afraid of Kick being another Twitch with the bans and TOS that he literally gave a streamer a 1 day ban for getting head on stream. 4) On Saturday, all submissions are watched on stream and the top 3 winners are voted via chat/viewer Strawpoll. If train gambles 20 days a month that means he only has to do 1000 spins per day for stake to be profiting off him. On November 27, Trainwrecks shared on his Twitter that he would be bringing back his gambling streams on December 1 because "Twitch has been boring. He likes all sorts of them, especially ones with excellent bonus rounds or the chance to win big. My assumption is that he probably gets a reaction out of chat/the stream and that reaction is more attention than he gets anywhere else so it feels nice to him. In this raunchy yet heartfelt comedy, a commitment-phobic binge drinker living in New York City must reevaluate her feelings about intimate. Popular Stake gambler TrainwrecksTV, aka Tyler Niknam, officially announces his ties to Kick. In the middle of the bar crawl with Asmon/Nick he kept trying to ask. The deadly collision last month between an Amtrak train with 282 people on board and a fully loaded dump truck in Missouri caused $4 million in damage, the National Transportation Safety Board. The place for all things livestreaming. Obviously some good shit that’s making him stay awake for that long. The jury is still out on whether Twitch should have taken a firm stance against gambling streams, the streaming platform had implemented anti-gambling measures back in August 2021. Trainwrecks Stake Sponsorship. Drama, Comedy. Train should take a break from streaming for a bit. Toast and him did a Twitch Rivals in Fortnite, they had fun playing together, and Toast invited him to play Valo. Reply. Set a time limit in advance. So now some virgin can select random people from the viewer list and give them subs. Twitch should be absolutely stacked with cash, but I don't really see much difference between now and many years back. Also I’m sure there is more instances. The rest goes to the streaming service. Tyler Faraz "Trainwreckstv" Niknam (referred to as Trainwreck) recently revealed that his original deal of $1 million a month with Stake has gone up by a lot, leading fans to speculate on the amount. Yea. Nov 16, 2017, 10:02 AM PST. BruceDropEmOff, a popular streamer and former member of One True King (OTK), was banned from Twitch for the fourth time on May 3. Its earcups are set with 40mm. He is an Iranian-origin American streamer. Collabs are about mutual enjoyment, not making sure everyone has a chance to get. He is from Texas but is now based in Canada. Screengrab via Destiny on YouTube. $8,751,500. 2019 and Oct. Updated December 6, 2022 at 9:45 p. ggx gang. com. 2. “Twitch has been boring. Last Modified Feb 20, 2023 06:37 GMT. BECOME PART OF THE APE GANG - me here:streams live on Twitch! Check out their videos, sign up to chat, and join their community. Shroud is sleeping. In a recent stream, Trainwreck gave fellow content creator Jake "JakeNBake" Abramson $120,000 so he could get a new car. Aaron Travis, seen using his computer at home in Vernon Hills on July 25, 2019, is a former heroin user who now makes a living by spending many hours a day streaming on the website Twitch, playing. 4 billion at 4% expected loss rate = 256 million = the amount he lost. Never chase your losses. 2015. 21 Savage won the award for Best Rap Song for his song "A Lot" at the 2020 Grammy Awards (Picture: 21 Savage)A lot of streamers have idiocy as their USP, whether intentional or faking. Twitch streamer Trainwreck recently revealed that he has been getting paid an insane amount for gambling on streams. After making back over $10 million of the $22. It's a bunch of bullshit really what Trainwrecks is saying anyway. CashApp supports Trainwrecks podcast on Twitch, and the amount made from this podcast is unknown. Photo. This but unironically. 1 million Twitch followers. How much does Trainwrecks make? Recently, TrainwrecksTV won a whopping $8. Now I’m only tuning in to see if there’s anythingoutside of Slots, but because he plays entire stream Slots Im not even checking anymore. December 20, 1990. Gambling streams return,” he said on November 27. Although Trainwrecks has twice as many subscribers on Twitch as Roshtein, a significant portion of his airtime is devoted to video games and chatting, while the latter is unconditionally recognized as the. How many people watch Trainwreckstv on Twitch? Trainwreckstv has been watched on Twitch by 13 129 Average Viewers, which have generated 285 554 Hours Watched in the last 30 days. Normally, Train will go live anywhere between 11 pm - 3 am. Getting many of his foolish viewers addicted to gambling and then doing giveaways and preaching how Godlike he is. We can tell, looking at your reaction. 27. During most of his stream outros, Train always mentions how "fried" he is. When you are this fat, 99% of what you need to do to lose weight is in your diet, not in how much you exercise, it can be even harmful for your knees and spine to move a lot. Trainwrecks revealed how he has almost given away an. the only ones affected cannot apply pressure since Twitch is the only viable option for streaming these days. When Train does gamble on Stake, he gambles large sums of money, often dealing in $1000 at a time slots bets. 9 million over the past nine months. $360 million over 16 months equals $22. From director Judd Apatow. In this case the embed is the Twitch Player and Kick where just embedding it on their site to make it seem OTK was streaming on their platform. Title. 2. com, where he will be a non-exclusive streamer and non-owner advisor. They explained to him that he would need to ask him directly for that. Height, Weight & Physical Appearance. 4k cash i believe. March 2023. Siikqtx • 5 yr. I am an individual streamer interested in accessing TwitchMetrics exclusive brand partnerships and streaming tools, along with advanced analytics only on my channel. In July 2021, he told fans that he had lost more than $2 million gambling off stream. He was just stuttering with the zipper on his pants. for anyone intrested, average hours streamed for all top 100 streamers (including the two women and channels like VALORANT) is 156. Twitch star Felix "xQc" Lengyel accidentally leaked a series of DMs with Trainwrecks, revealing new details on the gambling controversy. Some streamers have confirmed the numbers to be about right however it is speculative right now. this guy in trainwrecks chat who spams nigger, he had a lot of alts but everyone knows him because trainwrecks mods are so slow that everyone in chat sees it for like 10 minutes. Follow Trainwreck on Twitch | Twitter | Instagram. 75 million. That's why he can do giveaways to personal addresses and not strictly to accounts on stake. TrainwrecksTV Joins Kick As Adviser & Broadcaster. This is roundabout 180. 50 of each subscription, and less if they’re not in a first world country. Real NameTyler Faraz “Trainwreckstv” NiknamNet Worth$1 million to $2 million6 more rowsHow does trainwrecks make so much money? While playing a round of a gambling game during his livestream on Feb. He tweeted that he lost over 50 pounds during that time and had to take a break from streaming due to the stress it caused him. Twitch streamer Trainwrecks has received another ban, seemingly over using sexist language while streaming. Maloikny angry at mizkif SCATTER. Calling out Twitch's platform/creator split, streamer Trainwreck announces his partnership with a new streaming platform called Kick. Now the sad part, well I got diagnosed with eye cancer recently the doctor said that I might go blind in 1 week or 2 if. Trainwrecks has donated $5k to a Twitch streamer who jumped ship to Kick after being permanently banned from the Amazon-owned platform two years ago. Maybe the brain fog sides are real…. In recent times he’s parroted right-wing copypasta against trans people, streamed antisemitic content, asked Trainwrecks about getting Nazi sympathizer and white supremacist Nick Fuentes onto. Considering a bunch of streamers literally say stuff like ''That's $500 right there!'' when they gift 100. There was a cooking stream before with Lacari where he also called him “boy”. Tyler "Trainwreck" Niknam's announced move from Twitch to upstart streaming platform Kick has resulted in controversy on social media when it was revealed by an internet sleuth that Kick is owned by online gambling site Stake. No. Does trainwrecks still have a girlfriend?1. Here's everything you need to know. Twitter: Trainwrecks Trainwrecks’ now-deleted August 8 tweet on Twitch gambling. He, along with an unseen companion, immediately begin flipping out over the win, which netted what would be for any normal person a life-changing amount of money. Comment. Kick is the safe haven for criminals, scammers, addicts, abusers, offenders, and as trainwrecks puts it stupidity. Doyle's position, in part, is that the word trainwreck is just a repackaging of how women have been cut down to size since pretty much the dawn of time: Today's trainwreck is yesteryear's. The place for all things livestreaming. 6. Even so, it does show that Twitch has been taking notice of the prevalence of gambling streams on the platform however, it has yet to be determined if harsher. Or saying they'll match your gifted subs. Train easily clears 1000 spins a day. Funny how all this drama happened the same day when Trainwrecks does giveaways, I checked his stream and he was doing pretty well and had decent amount of viewers and tons of subs too. This revenue split system has been widely criticized , with many pointing out that YouTube uses a 70-30 ratio and has no issues. Trainwreckstv has been in the news lately due. Trainwreckstv’s gambling shows brought in a whopping. After this whole situation with DMCA strikes, Trainwreck contacted 21 Savage's representatives to get their permission to use his music on the stream. Hasan called out Trainwrecks during the stream organised by xQc. Casino games Trainwreckstv plays. Kripp has talked about why he streams when he does (starts late night goes to early AM) because the big Hearthstone streamers (back when Reckful was still daily) were not worth going against for views so he picked a part of the day when they were off and he became "the" HS streamer for that. Jesus the size difference. xQc segment starts at 13:31. 2. Regardless, slot streaming seems to be lucrative, at least for streamers with large audiences. Birthplace Austin , TX. The first. Trainwrecks has been heavily involved in the Twitch gambling stream debate in recent weeks. Thats why he should stop tbh,. Tarik playing with OTV&F was a lot of lucky coincidence. This can't be true. The movie has moved down the charts by -326 places since yesterday. Watch chat create fake charities now so they get the money, also the legit charities will take 70% of that as admin fees anyway.